On June 28,2020 we came together as a church and had an open discussion on race. We called it "What Now?" People shared feelings, experiences and perspectives. It was a great time. During the zoom discussion, links were shared in the chats. Here are those links. They are/were definitely more powerful in context of the meeting. None the less, here are all the links we shared in the chat (more were mentioned verbally). we look forward to another discussion soon. If you have resources that you want to share please email info@newsongLA.net
| What Now (Zoom Chat) | 06.28.2020 |
13:04:26 From jenn : our objective: to create a courageous space for a conversation about race. and to model how to have a conversation courageously about this topic.
13:04:38 From jenn : everyone might not agree. everyone will respect you and allow you to speak.
13:05:02 From jenn : there are challenging things to say and we want to learn from one another.
13:11:42 From Yen Ling Shek : is the sound cutting out for anyone else?
13:11:46 From Tiffany M's Husband : yes
13:11:52 From Tiffany M's Husband : its okay now
13:12:25 From Heather : yes, I’m not catching everything
13:19:23 From Valerie Williams : Lol, Norman!
13:23:12 From Valerie Williams : Thx, Norman.
13:37:35 From Stella Calimlim : The Calimlims will have to go, but thank you for having this conversation! I hope it's the first of many.
13:41:36 From Derek Williams : https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&url=https%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FOn_the_Origin_of_Species&psig=AOvVaw1IsjKbw0DdRIffi4KfrKRx&ust=1593463267963000&source=images&cd=vfe&ved=0CAIQjRxqFwoTCKitn7KvpeoCFQAAAAAdAAAAABAD
13:50:19 From Adam Edgerly to Manoj Mathai (Privately) : Acts 17:26 From one man he made all the nations, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he marked out their appointed times in history and the boundaries of their lands. 27 God did this so that they would seek him and perhaps reach out for him and find him, though he is not far from any one of us. 28 ‘For in him we live and move and have our being.’ As some of your own poets have said, ‘We are his offspring.’
13:54:13 From Derek Williams : Williams fam has to break away. Blessings family. God is sovereign and central. To His Glory, Amen.
13:57:18 From Tiffany M's Husband : A religious justification of racism and slavery:
"The African Trade for Negro slaves: Shewn to be consistent with principles of humanity, and with the laws of revealed religion." by Rev. Thomas Thompson
13:57:56 From Tiffany M's Husband : warning: its old english
13:58:02 From Adam Edgerly to Manoj Mathai (Privately) : Ephesians 2:11-15 11 Therefore remember that at one time you Gentiles in the flesh, called “the uncircumcision” by what is called the circumcision, which is made in the flesh by hands— 12 remember that you were at that time separated from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ. 14 For he himself is our peace, who has made us both one and has broken down in his flesh the dividing wall of hostility 15 by abolishing the law of commandments expressed in ordinances, that he might create in himself one new man in place of the two, so making peace,
14:05:48 From Jonathan Maner : Yeah, they’re all coming down too!
14:05:58 From Tiffany M's Husband : lol!
14:06:13 From Nicki Rankin : For additional knowledge on institutionalized racism, listen to the two part podcast called The Crime Machine about the creation of CompStat for police.
14:06:36 From Angela Alston : Take then down now!
14:07:30 From SuzAnne Mathai : Oh man, I had to step away and only caught the last bit of Adam’s last comment… did he just explain how justice issues somehow became taboo in the church? It seemed like he might have been talking about that. If so, I would love to hear that history… Adam can you send me any sources you have on that sometime (or maybe that’s not what he was talking about?)
14:08:20 From Yen Ling Shek : yes. social gospel led to ”fundamentals” response
14:09:09 From Manoj Mathai : https://smile.amazon.com/Color-Compromise-American-Churchs-Complicity/dp/0310113601/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=color+of+compromise&qid=1593378491&sr=8-1
14:09:25 From SuzAnne Mathai : Thanks Yen Ling, guess I
14:09:33 From SuzAnne Mathai : Look up the term social gospel
14:10:17 From SuzAnne Mathai : And thanks Manoj… guess that’s why the documentary series version of that book is in our Amazon Prime watch list :) Excited to check it out.
14:19:37 From Yen Ling Shek : thanks everyone! I’m logging off. love y’all!
14:20:27 From jenn : https://www.liberatedtogether.com/blog/2017/08/23/why-i-stopped-talking-about-racial-reconciliation-and-started-talking-about-white-supremacy?fbclid=IwAR22oVSv7h2xClmipnZqyQ_UAGyyhWeTbSgv928xy0VsBRKl1weZzJm8i2k Here’s the whole article. Worth a read.
14:25:49 From Manoj Mathai : https://www.ivpress.com/rethinking-incarceration
14:26:00 From Jonathan Maner : Gotta bounce! Great discussion! Lets do MORE!
14:27:20 From Tiffany M's Husband : autocentric supersessionism = seeing ourselves as the new and improved heroes/blessed and pure and victorious.
This is the lens from which many practice their "Christian" faith
14:30:09 From Adam Edgerly to Manoj Mathai (Privately) : https://faithfullymagazine.com/critical-race-theory-christians/
14:32:49 From Manoj Mathai : Tomorrow evening, 7-8:30 CST, see a documentary premiere and panel discussion about our friend and fellow Covenant Church pastor, Dr. Alex Gee, as he traces the roots of slavery through his family line… https://www.alexgee.com/justified-journey-virtual-film-premiere/
14:32:50 From Tiffany M's Husband : Thanks Norm, I would contend that SOME people have ignored law. Others haven't had the privlige of being able of ignoring law....and still get killed in under its judges and authority.
14:33:10 From Tiffany M's Husband : *able to ignore
14:34:03 From Angela Alston : Yes, it should be reexamined
14:34:33 From Manoj Mathai : https://faithfullymagazine.com/critical-race-theory-christians/
14:35:15 From Nicki Rankin : I gotta go. Many thanks!!
14:35:34 From Angela Alston : https://www.c-span.org/video/?c4844082/user-clip-ally-vs-conspirator-means-abolitionist-teacher
14:35:47 From Adam Edgerly : Thank you Nicki
14:38:33 From Star Edwards : The laws are not being ignored, the laws are just not pertaining to black people.
14:40:17 From Tiffany M's Husband : yes, not pertaining to the well being of black people. Just their subjugation and exploitation...
14:40:31 From Angela Alston : Jessi, thank you forswearing your understandings. I agree with everything you just said. Love your Ted Talk (ha, ha)
14:41:04 From Manoj Mathai : https://www.ivpress.com/unsettling-truths
14:41:08 From Newsong Los Angeles : Unsettling Truths - Soong Chan Rah & Mark Charles. https://www.amazon.com/Unsettling-Truths-Dehumanizing-Doctrine-Discovery/dp/0830845259
14:43:25 From Angela Alston : It should say Jessi, thank you for sharing your understandings. I agree with everything you just said.
14:43:45 From Jessi Johnson : Thank you, Angela, I appreciate that! :)
14:46:16 From Monique Chang : i would love to hear more about what biblical reconciliation looks like! like you said Pastor Adam, it’s not simple.
14:48:42 From Monique Chang : i have been thinking a lot about the story of Zachaeus, and of Paul who was a persecutor, and how God transformed their hearts. Jesus dined with tax collectors. so i wonder what it looks like from the Church to facilitate true reconciliation. but maybe that’s wholly God’s work
14:51:57 From Angela Alston : The law cannot cage your heart
14:52:03 From Angela Alston : I mean change
14:52:15 From SuzAnne Mathai : But it can definitely influence it
14:57:34 From Tiffany M's Husband : according to justice, we were all guilty and could not obey the laws. and they were good laws from God...
14:57:40 From Ayana Petteway : I see Gabriella and Marjana came off must - I think they would like to share.
14:57:47 From Ayana Petteway : *mute
14:57:59 From Manoj Mathai : We can go to Marjana and then Gabriella
15:02:02 From Adam Edgerly : https://www.cnn.com/2016/03/23/politics/john-ehrlichman-richard-nixon-drug-war-blacks-hippie/index.html
15:02:27 From MPink : A question - does anyone have advice on how do we impact the decision makers - We know discussions are happening now in advance of the laws being presented to be voted on?
15:02:56 From Jessi Johnson : Welcome Marjana!
15:05:55 From Janeshia : Thank you Marjana for coming with an open mind and loving heart
15:06:20 From Jessi Johnson : Marjana, I'd be happy to learn more about your personal history and also share some resources I've been reading to educate myself. Feel free to connect if you'd like! My email is k3nnywu@gmail.com. Cheers, Kenny.
15:18:01 From Adam Edgerly : https://www.facebook.com/adam.edgerly
15:18:56 From Angela Alston : Jus press Save Chat
15:19:01 From Angela Alston : Just
15:19:05 From RickEy Lumpkin II : Manoj you copy it, and I can make a page on the website with all the links
15:19:41 From Angela Alston : Will save Private and Everyone Chat
15:25:50 From jessicaselga : Hi, Jessica here. I’m a public school special ed teacher. I read a great book called “Case Studies on Diversity and Social Justice Education” by Paul C. Gorski ad Seems G. Pothini and it really opened my eyes to unconscious biases towards several different cultures. Would highly recommend to any teachers or people in the school system to read.
15:26:41 From Angela Alston : Not surprising at all. I graduated from there.
15:26:47 From Manoj Mathai : Thanks for the resource Jessica!
15:26:56 From jessicaselga : https://www.amazon.com/Studies-Diversity-Social-Justice-Education/dp/081537500X/ref=asc_df_081537500X/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=312820231662&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=844264406275799897&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9031067&hvtargid=pla-525924136779&psc=1&tag=&ref=&adgrpid=67906663571&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvadid=312820231662&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=844264406275799897&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9031067&hvtargid=pla-525924136779 Here’s a link on Amazon.
15:37:20 From Angela Alston : https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/35099718-so-you-want-to-talk-about-race
15:38:40 From Tiffany M's Husband : I'm worried about my unborn child(ren)!
15:39:48 From Angela Alston : Thank you Janeshia
15:40:07 From Janeshia : Yes - I love you family
15:40:14 From Marjana : Yes, thank you Janeshia!!!
15:40:17 From Manoj Mathai : There will be a part 2 with breakout discussions, more to come and will keep you posted
15:40:22 From Ayana Petteway : I agree fully. This was SUCH a blessing to hear from all the different view points in a environment of love, safety, and even above all that, factual knowledge. Can we do more of this and include other churches and believers that don't attend NSLA? I'm also looking forward to attending the conversation with the police panel. Can we put that on FB and IG ahead of time so that we can share it out to our friends and family?
15:40:23 From Randy Lee : thanks, Janeshia
15:40:26 From Janeshia : We are all in it to win it
15:40:30 From Angela Alston : That you NewsongLA for not having a one and done conversation about race.
15:40:58 From Angela Alston : I put a few in the chat
15:41:24 From Sarah M : Thanks for this, NSLA fam. This is just the beginning!
15:42:08 From RickEy Lumpkin II : yum dinner tables
15:42:09 From normhelgeson : thank you everyone. let our love be in the air!
15:42:19 From Angela Alston : I would love to tackle some of this reading with others that was put into the chat. Maybe we can have some bookclubs
15:42:21 From SuzAnne Mathai : Don’t forget to save the chat everyone!
15:43:42 From Sarah M : Angela, I'm down for that too
15:44:08 From Star Edwards : Thank you all!
15:44:08 From MPink : Thank you New Song LA Leadership TEAM!!
15:44:10 From Chows : Thanks NSLA!
15:44:36 From Janeshia : Thank u Pastor for your courage in leading us
15:45:11 From Manoj Mathai : 🙌🏾❤️
15:46:50 From Manoj Mathai : https://www.biola.edu/directory/people/stan-jantz
13:04:38 From jenn : everyone might not agree. everyone will respect you and allow you to speak.
13:05:02 From jenn : there are challenging things to say and we want to learn from one another.
13:11:42 From Yen Ling Shek : is the sound cutting out for anyone else?
13:11:46 From Tiffany M's Husband : yes
13:11:52 From Tiffany M's Husband : its okay now
13:12:25 From Heather : yes, I’m not catching everything
13:19:23 From Valerie Williams : Lol, Norman!
13:23:12 From Valerie Williams : Thx, Norman.
13:37:35 From Stella Calimlim : The Calimlims will have to go, but thank you for having this conversation! I hope it's the first of many.
13:41:36 From Derek Williams : https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&url=https%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FOn_the_Origin_of_Species&psig=AOvVaw1IsjKbw0DdRIffi4KfrKRx&ust=1593463267963000&source=images&cd=vfe&ved=0CAIQjRxqFwoTCKitn7KvpeoCFQAAAAAdAAAAABAD
13:50:19 From Adam Edgerly to Manoj Mathai (Privately) : Acts 17:26 From one man he made all the nations, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he marked out their appointed times in history and the boundaries of their lands. 27 God did this so that they would seek him and perhaps reach out for him and find him, though he is not far from any one of us. 28 ‘For in him we live and move and have our being.’ As some of your own poets have said, ‘We are his offspring.’
13:54:13 From Derek Williams : Williams fam has to break away. Blessings family. God is sovereign and central. To His Glory, Amen.
13:57:18 From Tiffany M's Husband : A religious justification of racism and slavery:
"The African Trade for Negro slaves: Shewn to be consistent with principles of humanity, and with the laws of revealed religion." by Rev. Thomas Thompson
13:57:56 From Tiffany M's Husband : warning: its old english
13:58:02 From Adam Edgerly to Manoj Mathai (Privately) : Ephesians 2:11-15 11 Therefore remember that at one time you Gentiles in the flesh, called “the uncircumcision” by what is called the circumcision, which is made in the flesh by hands— 12 remember that you were at that time separated from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ. 14 For he himself is our peace, who has made us both one and has broken down in his flesh the dividing wall of hostility 15 by abolishing the law of commandments expressed in ordinances, that he might create in himself one new man in place of the two, so making peace,
14:05:48 From Jonathan Maner : Yeah, they’re all coming down too!
14:05:58 From Tiffany M's Husband : lol!
14:06:13 From Nicki Rankin : For additional knowledge on institutionalized racism, listen to the two part podcast called The Crime Machine about the creation of CompStat for police.
14:06:36 From Angela Alston : Take then down now!
14:07:30 From SuzAnne Mathai : Oh man, I had to step away and only caught the last bit of Adam’s last comment… did he just explain how justice issues somehow became taboo in the church? It seemed like he might have been talking about that. If so, I would love to hear that history… Adam can you send me any sources you have on that sometime (or maybe that’s not what he was talking about?)
14:08:20 From Yen Ling Shek : yes. social gospel led to ”fundamentals” response
14:09:09 From Manoj Mathai : https://smile.amazon.com/Color-Compromise-American-Churchs-Complicity/dp/0310113601/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=color+of+compromise&qid=1593378491&sr=8-1
14:09:25 From SuzAnne Mathai : Thanks Yen Ling, guess I
14:09:33 From SuzAnne Mathai : Look up the term social gospel
14:10:17 From SuzAnne Mathai : And thanks Manoj… guess that’s why the documentary series version of that book is in our Amazon Prime watch list :) Excited to check it out.
14:19:37 From Yen Ling Shek : thanks everyone! I’m logging off. love y’all!
14:20:27 From jenn : https://www.liberatedtogether.com/blog/2017/08/23/why-i-stopped-talking-about-racial-reconciliation-and-started-talking-about-white-supremacy?fbclid=IwAR22oVSv7h2xClmipnZqyQ_UAGyyhWeTbSgv928xy0VsBRKl1weZzJm8i2k Here’s the whole article. Worth a read.
14:25:49 From Manoj Mathai : https://www.ivpress.com/rethinking-incarceration
14:26:00 From Jonathan Maner : Gotta bounce! Great discussion! Lets do MORE!
14:27:20 From Tiffany M's Husband : autocentric supersessionism = seeing ourselves as the new and improved heroes/blessed and pure and victorious.
This is the lens from which many practice their "Christian" faith
14:30:09 From Adam Edgerly to Manoj Mathai (Privately) : https://faithfullymagazine.com/critical-race-theory-christians/
14:32:49 From Manoj Mathai : Tomorrow evening, 7-8:30 CST, see a documentary premiere and panel discussion about our friend and fellow Covenant Church pastor, Dr. Alex Gee, as he traces the roots of slavery through his family line… https://www.alexgee.com/justified-journey-virtual-film-premiere/
14:32:50 From Tiffany M's Husband : Thanks Norm, I would contend that SOME people have ignored law. Others haven't had the privlige of being able of ignoring law....and still get killed in under its judges and authority.
14:33:10 From Tiffany M's Husband : *able to ignore
14:34:03 From Angela Alston : Yes, it should be reexamined
14:34:33 From Manoj Mathai : https://faithfullymagazine.com/critical-race-theory-christians/
14:35:15 From Nicki Rankin : I gotta go. Many thanks!!
14:35:34 From Angela Alston : https://www.c-span.org/video/?c4844082/user-clip-ally-vs-conspirator-means-abolitionist-teacher
14:35:47 From Adam Edgerly : Thank you Nicki
14:38:33 From Star Edwards : The laws are not being ignored, the laws are just not pertaining to black people.
14:40:17 From Tiffany M's Husband : yes, not pertaining to the well being of black people. Just their subjugation and exploitation...
14:40:31 From Angela Alston : Jessi, thank you forswearing your understandings. I agree with everything you just said. Love your Ted Talk (ha, ha)
14:41:04 From Manoj Mathai : https://www.ivpress.com/unsettling-truths
14:41:08 From Newsong Los Angeles : Unsettling Truths - Soong Chan Rah & Mark Charles. https://www.amazon.com/Unsettling-Truths-Dehumanizing-Doctrine-Discovery/dp/0830845259
14:43:25 From Angela Alston : It should say Jessi, thank you for sharing your understandings. I agree with everything you just said.
14:43:45 From Jessi Johnson : Thank you, Angela, I appreciate that! :)
14:46:16 From Monique Chang : i would love to hear more about what biblical reconciliation looks like! like you said Pastor Adam, it’s not simple.
14:48:42 From Monique Chang : i have been thinking a lot about the story of Zachaeus, and of Paul who was a persecutor, and how God transformed their hearts. Jesus dined with tax collectors. so i wonder what it looks like from the Church to facilitate true reconciliation. but maybe that’s wholly God’s work
14:51:57 From Angela Alston : The law cannot cage your heart
14:52:03 From Angela Alston : I mean change
14:52:15 From SuzAnne Mathai : But it can definitely influence it
14:57:34 From Tiffany M's Husband : according to justice, we were all guilty and could not obey the laws. and they were good laws from God...
14:57:40 From Ayana Petteway : I see Gabriella and Marjana came off must - I think they would like to share.
14:57:47 From Ayana Petteway : *mute
14:57:59 From Manoj Mathai : We can go to Marjana and then Gabriella
15:02:02 From Adam Edgerly : https://www.cnn.com/2016/03/23/politics/john-ehrlichman-richard-nixon-drug-war-blacks-hippie/index.html
15:02:27 From MPink : A question - does anyone have advice on how do we impact the decision makers - We know discussions are happening now in advance of the laws being presented to be voted on?
15:02:56 From Jessi Johnson : Welcome Marjana!
15:05:55 From Janeshia : Thank you Marjana for coming with an open mind and loving heart
15:06:20 From Jessi Johnson : Marjana, I'd be happy to learn more about your personal history and also share some resources I've been reading to educate myself. Feel free to connect if you'd like! My email is k3nnywu@gmail.com. Cheers, Kenny.
15:18:01 From Adam Edgerly : https://www.facebook.com/adam.edgerly
15:18:56 From Angela Alston : Jus press Save Chat
15:19:01 From Angela Alston : Just
15:19:05 From RickEy Lumpkin II : Manoj you copy it, and I can make a page on the website with all the links
15:19:41 From Angela Alston : Will save Private and Everyone Chat
15:25:50 From jessicaselga : Hi, Jessica here. I’m a public school special ed teacher. I read a great book called “Case Studies on Diversity and Social Justice Education” by Paul C. Gorski ad Seems G. Pothini and it really opened my eyes to unconscious biases towards several different cultures. Would highly recommend to any teachers or people in the school system to read.
15:26:41 From Angela Alston : Not surprising at all. I graduated from there.
15:26:47 From Manoj Mathai : Thanks for the resource Jessica!
15:26:56 From jessicaselga : https://www.amazon.com/Studies-Diversity-Social-Justice-Education/dp/081537500X/ref=asc_df_081537500X/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=312820231662&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=844264406275799897&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9031067&hvtargid=pla-525924136779&psc=1&tag=&ref=&adgrpid=67906663571&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvadid=312820231662&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=844264406275799897&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9031067&hvtargid=pla-525924136779 Here’s a link on Amazon.
15:37:20 From Angela Alston : https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/35099718-so-you-want-to-talk-about-race
15:38:40 From Tiffany M's Husband : I'm worried about my unborn child(ren)!
15:39:48 From Angela Alston : Thank you Janeshia
15:40:07 From Janeshia : Yes - I love you family
15:40:14 From Marjana : Yes, thank you Janeshia!!!
15:40:17 From Manoj Mathai : There will be a part 2 with breakout discussions, more to come and will keep you posted
15:40:22 From Ayana Petteway : I agree fully. This was SUCH a blessing to hear from all the different view points in a environment of love, safety, and even above all that, factual knowledge. Can we do more of this and include other churches and believers that don't attend NSLA? I'm also looking forward to attending the conversation with the police panel. Can we put that on FB and IG ahead of time so that we can share it out to our friends and family?
15:40:23 From Randy Lee : thanks, Janeshia
15:40:26 From Janeshia : We are all in it to win it
15:40:30 From Angela Alston : That you NewsongLA for not having a one and done conversation about race.
15:40:58 From Angela Alston : I put a few in the chat
15:41:24 From Sarah M : Thanks for this, NSLA fam. This is just the beginning!
15:42:08 From RickEy Lumpkin II : yum dinner tables
15:42:09 From normhelgeson : thank you everyone. let our love be in the air!
15:42:19 From Angela Alston : I would love to tackle some of this reading with others that was put into the chat. Maybe we can have some bookclubs
15:42:21 From SuzAnne Mathai : Don’t forget to save the chat everyone!
15:43:42 From Sarah M : Angela, I'm down for that too
15:44:08 From Star Edwards : Thank you all!
15:44:08 From MPink : Thank you New Song LA Leadership TEAM!!
15:44:10 From Chows : Thanks NSLA!
15:44:36 From Janeshia : Thank u Pastor for your courage in leading us
15:45:11 From Manoj Mathai : 🙌🏾❤️
15:46:50 From Manoj Mathai : https://www.biola.edu/directory/people/stan-jantz
